as the title said, I am learning common lisp right now and using portacle, following Practical Common Lisp by Peter Seibel.
I found it quite annoying that the Slime-repl-sbcl buffer keep the writing at the end of the screen (using C-l or C-v doesn't help since once I try to execute an expression it will roll back to the end of the screen)
Is there anywhere to improve this? (should I just write on a text file and compile it? the only similar subject I found was about Cider repl and couldn't understand it, since I am still new to lisp)
Thank you for your time
I would like this fixed too. No solution yet. In slime-repl.el, I found:
scroll-conservatively (variable):
A value of zero means always recenter point if it moves off screen.
my test wasn't conclusive.
slime-display-output-buffer (function), which calls slime-repl-show-maximum-output, which role is to
Put the end of the buffer at the bottom of the window.
I rewrote slime-display-output-buffer without this call, but that wasn't conclusive either.
Maybe I tested badly.
(I'm making this answer a wiki)
You would indeed typically write in a source file, and compile each expression separately. Use the REPL only to test functions or do simple computations. To compile functions (or really, any toplevel expression), use C-c C-c - bound to slime-compile-defun by default - when the point (= your cursor) is inside the function's code. The REPL will then "know" of it, so you can test it there, but as it is now written in file, you can also modify it without having to copy/paste anything ! Just make sure to recompile functions that you modify !
If you want to compile/load entire files at once, look at the other compilation commands, e.g. slime-compile-and-load-file (see the SLIME manual, and its Compilation section)
For your problem: there is Emacs variable, named comint-scroll-to-bottom-on-input (or something along those lines, can't remember exactly ...) which enables the behaviour you are seeing, so that you don't have to scroll back to enter new expressions. It is possible that SLIME has another variable which configuring this behaviour for its REPL; in that case, it would probably be named almost the same, and you can set it to nil to disable it.
Finally, don't hesitate to look at the other tools provided by SLIME ! For example, it comes with an "inspector" (see the relevant section), that you can use instead of evaluating expressions such as *db* in the REPL. In that simple case, it makes no real difference, but if you start having - say - hash-tables or different structures/classes, it becomes an incredible tool for interactive development, to examine the internal of almost everything, redefine things directly from within the inspector without needing complex accessors, and so on.
Related
I've been seeing this a lot lately and am not sure if it is an SBCL issue, an Emacs problem, a SLIME problem, or my own understanding of what it means to "compile" a lisp file.
I will have a function, say this:
(defun some-function (x) (call-this-funcshun))
I will compile and run this, and I'll get an error that my function call-this-funcshun is not defined. Then I realize that is because there is a typo. So change it:
(defun some-function (x) (call-this-function))
In Emacs, I recompile the entire file with Control-C Control-K (Emacs saves automatically before the compile as well). Emacs then reports Compilation finished. I move to the REPL. I try it again, type (some-function whatever) and I get the same error. I search through the small lisp file and see that call-this-funcshun is clearly nowhere in it. Yet I have an error that this function is not defined.
Is there some sort of caching that Emacs or SBCL is doing that causes this to hang around? It's driving me nuts. Worth noting that if I quit SLIME and then launch it again, the issue is resolved. Also worth noting that this does not affect all my code edits, just occasionally.
Maybe the file is not loaded for some reason.
I would set *load-verbose* to T and watch that LOAD actually gets called.
Setting *load-print* to T would then also cause the printing of information about definitions loaded.
I've seen two conditions that can lead to behavior that looks like what you saw:
When the symbol in the file is not the same as the symbol at the REPL. The symbol's name is only a shorthand for identifying the symbol, and the same shorthand can identify different symbols based on which package you use it in. There are some ways to be surprised about which symbol you are referring to, so it can be worth checking with SYMBOL-PACKAGE even when you are pretty sure that they are the same.
When the buffer isn't saved. I'm not sure how C-c C-k deals with this now (because I edited it to auto-save for me), but in general compiling and loading tools tend to work from the file not the buffer.
I'm an experienced C++/.NET/Java Windows/web programmer trying to learn (Common) Lisp. I'm reading Practical Common Lisp and using SLIME.
I'm getting the Lisp language easily enough, but I'm having trouble groking the mechanics of development. One of my issues is dealing with Emacs. I have no experience with it and find it generally confusing with hard to find/figure out commands.
Specific questions:
I get the REPL, but I don't quite get how I can use it effectively. When I need to change a function I have to retype the defun and make changes (tedious and error prone). How can I do this better?
How do I get from entering code at the REPL to actually having a program? I'm used to the C model where you have code files that you can review, edit and recompile. I know Lisp has something similar (via the load function), but how does one get a function I just defined and tested into a file to be saved? I'm hoping there's a better method than my current select+copy+paste.
How do you debug errors? Is there any ability to step into code like I would with other languages?
As long as the S-expression is valid, I don't get any errors when entering a (defun ...). It's not until I try to use it that I find out it's not valid. Is there any way to get errors sooner (i.e. compile the code)?
Is there some IDE that would be more familiar to me or allow me to play with the language easier?
Should I switch to learning Scheme instead?
Any tips would be greatly appreciated!
-I get the REPL, but don't quite get how I can use it effectively. When I
need to change a function I have to
retype the defun and make changes
(tedious and error prone). How can I
do this better?
-How do I get from entering code at the REPL to actually having a program?
I'm used to the C model where you have
code files that you can review, edit
and recompile. I know lisp has
something similar (via the load
function), but how does one get a
function I just defined and tested
into a file to be saved? I'm hoping
there's a better method than my
current select+copy+paste.
Load SLIME. Enter code in your .lisp file, and then run slime-eval-buffer to load all your code into Lisp. Then, for a specific function you are hacking on C-e, C-j to redefine it in your running Lisp.
-How do you debug errors? Is there any ability to step into code like I would with other languages?
Yes. (trace 'my-function) - or some variant on that - and when my-function is called, it will break into the debugger.
-As long as the S-expression is valid, I don't get any errors when entering a
(defun ...). It's not until I try to
use it that I find out it's not valid.
Is there any way to get errors sooner
(i.e. compile the code)?
To some degree, that is a characteristic of dynamic languages (Python, Perl, Ruby, Lisp, etc.). Try SBCL for better error-checking.
-Is there some IDE that would be more familiar to me or allow me to play with the language easier?
Emacs is the free IDE for Lisp. Allegro has a free edition I believe; I've never tried it though..
-Should I switch to learning Scheme instead?
Nah, Scheme is not as pragmatic a language.
I'm an experienced C++/.NET/Java Windows/Web programmer trying to learn (Common) Lisp. I'm reading Practical Common Lisp and using SLIME.
One can also use the LispWorks Personal Edition for learning Lisp. It has some limitations and the full product is commercial, but it is quite a bit easier to use.
I get the REPL, but don't quite get how I can use it effectively. When I need to change a function I have to retype the defun and make changes (tedious and error prone). How can I do this better?
The REPL has a history. With keyboard commands you can get back prior input and change it. Other than that just edit a Lisp file and compile code from there. In Lisp you can compile/eval individual expressions and definitions. Typical IDEs like SLIME, LispWorks or Allegro CL allow you to run code also from normal Lisp text windows - additionally to executing expressions in the REPLA (aka Listener).
How do I get from entering code at the REPL to actually having a program? I'm used to the C model where you have code files that you can review, edit and recompile. I know Lisp has something similar (via the load function), but how does one get a function I just defined and tested into a file to be saved? I'm hoping there's a better method than my current select+copy+paste.
Copy and paste in one thing. But the correct way is to work from a text file in an editor window. One can compile/load expressions, the editor buffer or the associated file.
How do you debug errors? Is there any ability to step into code like I would with other languages?
See STEP, TRACE and related. SLIME, LispWorks and Allegro CL have lots of additional features.
As long as the S-expression is valid, I don't get any errors when entering a (defun ...). It's not until I try to use it that I find out it's not valid. Is there any way to get errors sooner (i.e. compile the code)?
For many cases one uses a compiler. The compiler will find a range of errors and also will note when something is unusual (for example a function does not exist or a variable has not been defined).
-Is there some IDE that would be more familiar to me or allow me to play with the language easier?
LispWorks, Allegro CL are the best under Windows. There are some alternatives like Corman Lisp (I don't know it is maintained right now) or even Ufasoft Lisp.
Should I switch to learning Scheme instead?
Not really.
It doesn't sound like you're really using SLIME, or at least not in the way it was intended to be used. ("have to retype the defun", "the C model where you have code files")
I recommend watching some SLIME screencasts (or, even better, watching a Lisp programmer use SLIME for a few minutes, if you have one handy). The SLIME webpage has a couple.
It sounds like you'd really enjoy the DrRacket IDE. Racket is closer to Scheme than to Common Lisp, but you could dip your toes into the Lisp family without the speed bump of the Emacs style of development.
I am not a very good at using Emacs, but the feature I would like the most would be some integration with help/documentation for a particular language/API I use at the moment. I would imagine that there would be help displayed in another buffer depending on where I put my cursor while editing.
I wonder if there is a package that does that, even if it would be very simple, just displaying some file based on the keyword. I think there is, but I cannot find it ("help" is a too generic word).
(In particular, I would like to have this help for Common Lisp, but other languages, such as Java or C, could be useful.)
ILISP and SLIME provide several methods for looking up a function; see the Emacs wiki and the SLIME documentation. Or just built into Emacs itself, there are functions like C-h f to get function help or M-x man; both use the text at the point by default. You could pretty easily adapt them to work for another language of your choice.
Assuming you are using SLIME for common-lisp, you can take a look at slime-autodoc-mode.
Sorry, can't help with a generic solution for this.
You can set up the CLHS root for SLIME in your .emacs file:
(setq common-lisp-hyperspec-root "/usr/share/doc/hyperspec/HyperSpec/")
Adjust the path to where you put your HyperSpec.
Then, C-c C-d h with point at a symbol will look it up there in your browser.
One thing you might like to enable is eldoc-mode, by adding (turn-on-eldoc-mode) to your mode hook functions for the appropriate programming modes.
In ElDoc mode, the echo area displays information about a
function or variable in the text where point is. If point is
on a documented variable, it displays the first line of that
variable's doc string. Otherwise it displays the argument list
of the function called in the expression point is on.
This is probably less than you were after, but it still makes a good companion to a fuller-featured contextual help system, and there are a number of programming modes that support it.
I wrote a Lisp function earlier that had an error. The first challenge was to figure out how to view the function again. That challenge is solved. Now that I see WHAT I have done wrong, I want to modify the contents of the defined function without rewriting the whole thing?
Seems like as intelligent as Lisp is, there HAS to be a way to do this, I just don't know what it is because I am fairly new to the language. Can this be done?
Judging from the question, I think that you have a strange setup. It seems to indicate that you are writing your functions directly at the REPL. Don't do that.
The usual setup is to have an IDE (for example, Emacs with Slime) where you edit a source file, and then "send" top-level forms (like function definitions) to the REPL.
Every useful REPL has a history functionality. It allows you to move in the history of your input backwards and forwards.
When I write code in the REPL simple keystrokes like m-p gets back earlier code. Some IDEs might even be able to locate source code in a Lisp listener with m-. .
In most REPLS you can also search incrementally backwards.
If you want a log of your input use the function DRIBBLE..
There are some more options, like retrieving the code from the function - when a Lisp IDE supports that.
There is the advice functionality in many Lisps, which lets you run additional code before or after or around an existing function. But the comment is right, why wouldn't you rewrite a function if you're still learning and trying things out? Do they charge you by the compile cycle?
I have been using Emacs for more than three years now but it still takes me days to write even small functions in Lisp. I've looked through GNU Emacs Lisp Reference Manual but it's huge and structured completely opposite from JavaDoc, not from functions to descriptions but the other way around.
What will make my life much easier is some sort of small JavaDoc like document with most commonly used Emacs internal functions and they quick description.
(point) - returns current position in buffer
(save-excursion (p)) - saves current position in buffer before
executing (p) and restores it afterward.
Does anyone know where I can find something like that?
Have you tried the build-in manual in emacs? Open any lisp buffer (or any buffer in lisp mode), move your point to any function or variable, and hit C-h f (for function) or C-h v (for variable). Emacs will give you a fairly concise description of the function/variable.
For example, the manual content for (save-excursion) is
save-excursion is a special form in `C source code'.
(save-excursion &rest BODY)
Save point, mark, and current buffer; execute BODY; restore those things.
Executes BODY just like `progn'.
The values of point, mark and the current buffer are restored
even in case of abnormal exit (throw or error).
The state of activation of the mark is also restored.
This construct does not save `deactivate-mark', and therefore
functions that change the buffer will still cause deactivation
of the mark at the end of the command. To prevent that, bind
`deactivate-mark' with `let'.
The good thing also is the build-in manual give you "link" to to the source code of the function and to other functions that might be related, which make it nice to browse around.
Of course you can't learn lisp this way, but for looking up documentation of function this is a nice starter. When you find the build-in manual not understandable (which sometimes does happen), then it's time for you to google the function ;)
This site has some emacs lisp summary information that may be useful: http://xahlee.org/emacs/elisp.html.
In particularly, check out these links on that page: Basic Text-editing Functions, Emacs Lisp Idioms and Batch Text Processing
The GNU Introduction to emacs lisp is certainly more approachable than the reference manual.
I would add a couple of things:
M-x apropos - searches functions and variables for whatever string you specify (e.g. directory). Note that this is slightly different than C-h a, which only finds interactive functions
find a similar piece of code and copy it - you can learn an awful lot about how to do things by looking at what's already done. If you have a particular function you want to see examples of, one good way is to visit the main lisp source directory in dired (e.g. d:/product/emacs/lisp or /usr/share/lib/emacs/lisp) and do % g which will grep through all files looking for whatever string you type. Open up that file and see what other people have done with it.
C-h f and C-h v - as someone else mentioned, you can open up source, position point over a function or variable and then get documentation on it.
Check out the Emacs wiki, which has a crap-load of Emacs lisp modules for you to peruse.
I think you are taking the wrong approach. When learning a
programming language and set of libraries (collectively, "Emacs
Lisp"), you need to approach it on both the micro and macro scale.
Before you can start writing software, you need to know what tools you
have available. That is what the Emacs Lisp manual aims to educate
you on. You really need to sit down and read the whole thing. That
way you know what features Emacs provides.
After you do that, you need "micro-level" information. There are
a number of sources that provide this. If you have a general idea of
what you need to do ("working with buffers"), then the Lisp reference
is a good place to figure out what you need to know. If you know that
there's a function that does what you want, but don't quite remember
the name, then M-x apropos (C-u C-h a) will help you search the
documentation. If you know what function you want to use, but don't
remember quite how it works, then M-x describe-function (C-h f)
will sort that out for you.
So anyway, the key is to learn Emacs Lisp, and then let Emacs help you
with the details. A list of functions isn't going to teach you much.
(Oh, one more thing -- you should familiarize yourself with Common
Lisp. Most Emacs libraries use cl, which are the useful CL
functions implemented in Emacs Lisp. loop, destructuring-bind,
defun*, and so on are all there, and they are very helpful.)
Good suggestions from others -- Emacs help system is your friend.
In addition:
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsNewbieWithIcicles
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Icicles_-_Progressive_Completion
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Icicles_-_Nutshell_View#ChippingAway
In order to understand what's on, quite often it's useful having a look at the source code.
http://repo.or.cz/w/elbb.git/blob/HEAD:/code/Go-to-Emacs-Lisp-Definition.el
Have you tryed <f1> f ? It is bound to describe-function. Example with point:
point is a built-in function in C source code.
(point)
Return value of point, as an integer.
Beginning of buffer is position (point-min).
[back]
Like most Lisp systeme, Emacs has an integrated documentation tool!
Any Lisp function or variable can declare an optional doc string.
Almost all standard command or function do declare a usefull doc string.
Emacs (like most Lisp systems) allows you to display the doc string of any function or variable (<f1> f and <f1> v) at any time.
When displayed, the doc string is browsable, meaning that you can click on symbols to see their doc string, or go to the source of the corresponding function or variable.
As soon as you evaluate any defun or defvar, its doc string is available through describe-function or describe-variable: this doc is alive!
M-x find-library RET <library name> is all you really need
If you're willing to fork over money for a dead tree, I'd recommend
(source: oreilly.com)
In XEmacs, and I believe in Emacs as well,
pressing C-h f, then the tab key for tab completion, which at that point is all functions, will give you a list of functions the editor knows about.
You just use cursor keys and scroll to one you want to know about and press enter to see details.
If a list of functions, with further info available, is what you want, that will give it to you.
This list is all currently available functions, so if you have packages of lisp installed, it shows the functions those packages supply as well as native functions. In my copy of XEmacs, today, I have 6,586 functions in the list. Emacs will be similar.
The problem is that not all functions have names that make them context-meaningful (ie not all menu variables/functions have the word menu in them, so you will miss some things if you go by names only.
You can use the INFO pages (on the menu) to view them more topically arranged, and get to the same usage information.
Download source code for Emacs. Go to src/ folder and type:
grep -r DEFUN *
You will get list of all primitive Lisp functions of Emacs.