I've recently had to switch from Visual Studio to Eclipse CDT.
It would seem that Eclipse "workspaces" are not quite like VS solution files.
Eclipse workspaces use the .metadata folder for managing multiple projects, but there doesn't seem to be a simple distinction between user settings or IDE preferences and project/solution settings.
What I want is a way to group a collection of related (and dependent) projects together and have that data live in source control without all the other user specific stuff that developers don't need to share.
You know, like a .sln file in Visual Studio.
Does Eclipse just not work this way? (And if not, then why not?)
Yes you are right eclipse does not manage projects in the same way VS does with solution files. However for putting a group of related projects into a VCS eclipse has the concept of a Team Project Set available in File->Export then under the Team folder there is Team Project Set.
Like JProgrammer said there is Team Project Set. You can send your colleagues a bunch of .psf files, works similar to VS.NET. I can only say we have good expierience with this feature.
I often find IDE's have a preferred way to work. Sure, you might be able to get the IDE to do it your way, but you'll probably end up fighting it all the way.
Try to use your IDE like their makers intended you to. They have made presumptions on how you are supposed to do your work. They have optimized the user experience according to those presumptions.
Go with the flow. Anything else will make you gnarly, bitter, wrinkly and give you gastly breath!
Corollary: If you can, choose the IDE that makes the same presumptions about workflow as you do!
Related
This has happened many times on many projects and it makes development difficult!
I work with a group of engineers. I often import a project someone else has saved into, say:
c:\git\newproject
The files are there in "c:\git\newproject", so I start code development, doing builds etc.
But my changes are not in "c:\git\newproject"! (?) Instead they are in
c:\Users\<myname>\<workspace name>\newproject
WTF? The builds will be there too. So I look in the project resources. It says:
PROJECT_LOC "c:\Users\<myname>\<workspace>\newproject"
No, that's wrong. I can't push that! Why was it set this way? How can I change it?
As you can tell, I'm getting very frustrated. It's happened to me many times and no one I talk to has any idea why.
You obviously imported the projects via the Existing Projects into Workspace import wizard with the option Copy projects into workspace.
Better use File > Open Projects from File System... which also works for non-Eclipse projects.
I have seen, read and thought of different ways of using Workspaces (per project, per application (multi-asseted or not), per program language, per target (web-development, plugins,..), and so on) and I am still doubting what the best approach is.
Can anyone give a detailed, but not a page long insight into this?
This involves a lot of sub-questions, so to speak, and I don't know all the specific sub-questions I should ask, as I am sure I don't know all aspects of Eclipse (and Workspaces), but I'll try to give an example of what I am looking for:
What for?
What did the Eclipse development team expect it to be used for?
What do other/most people think?
What do you think?
... ?
Why?
Are there configuration conflicts vs. sharing merits?
Any filespace reasons?
Performance?
... ?
I am speaking of the minimum use-case for a developer that uses different languages and protocols, not necessarily all of them in one project (E.g. Php, Javascript and XML for some projects, C# for others, Java and SQL for still others, etc..)
Edit 2012-11-27: Don't get me wrong. I don't doubt the use of
Workspaces, I just want to use it as it is meant to be or otherwise if
anyone would think it better. So "what for?" means: What's the best use? And
"why?" actually targets on the "what for?", in other words: tell me the reasons
for your answer.
I'll provide you with my vision of somebody who feels very uncomfortable in the Java world, which I assume is also your case.
What it is
A workspace is a concept of grouping together:
a set of (somehow) related projects
some configuration pertaining to all these projects
some settings for Eclipse itself
This happens by creating a directory and putting inside it (you don't have to do it, it's done for you) files that manage to tell Eclipse these information. All you have to do explicitly is to select the folder where these files will be placed. And this folder doesn't need to be the same where you put your source code - preferentially it won't be.
Exploring each item above:
a set of (somehow) related projects
Eclipse seems to always be opened in association with a particular workspace, i.e., if you are in a workspace A and decide to switch to workspace B (File > Switch Workspaces), Eclipse will close itself and reopen. All projects that were associated with workspace A (and were appearing in the Project Explorer) won't appear anymore and projects associated with workspace B will now appear. So it seems that a project, to be open in Eclipse, MUST be associated to a workspace.
Notice that this doesn't mean that the project source code must be inside the workspace. The workspace will, somehow, have a relation to the physical path of your projects in your disk (anybody knows how? I've looked inside the workspace searching for some file pointing to the projects paths, without success).
This way, a project can be inside more than 1 workspace at a time. So it seems good to keep your workspace and your source code separated.
some configuration pertaining to all these projects
I heard that something, like the Java compiler version (like 1.7, e.g - I don't know if 'version' is the word here), is a workspace-level configuration. If you have several projects inside your workspace, and compile them inside of Eclipse, all of them will be compiled with the same Java compiler.
some settings for Eclipse itself
Some things like your key bindings are stored at a workspace-level, also. So, if you define that ctrl+tab will switch tabs in a smart way (not stacking them), this will only be bound to your current workspace. If you want to use the same key binding in another workspace (and I think you want!), it seems that you have to export/import them between workspaces (if that's true, this IDE was built over some really strange premises). Here is a link on this.
It also seems that workspaces are not necessarily compatible between different Eclipse versions. This article suggests that you name your workspaces containing the name of the Eclipse version.
And, more important, once you pick a folder to be your workspace, don't touch any file inside there or you are in for some trouble.
How I think is a good way to use it
(actually, as I'm writing this, I don't know how to use this in a good way, that's why I was looking for an answer – that I'm trying to assemble here)
Create a folder for your projects:
/projects
Create a folder for each project and group the projects' sub-projects inside of it:
/projects/proj1/subproj1_1
/projects/proj1/subproj1_2
/projects/proj2/subproj2_1
Create a separate folder for your workspaces:
/eclipse-workspaces
Create workspaces for your projects:
/eclipse-workspaces/proj1
/eclipse-workspaces/proj2
The whole point of a workspace is to group a set of related projects together that usually make up an application. The workspace framework comes down to the eclipse.core.resources plugin and it naturally by design makes sense.
Projects have natures, builders are attached to specific projects and as you change resources in one project you can see in real time compile or other issues in projects that are in the same workspace. So the strategy I suggest is have different workspaces for different projects you work on but without a workspace in eclipse there would be no concept of a collection of projects and configurations and after all it's an IDE tool.
If that does not make sense ask how Net Beans or Visual Studio addresses this? It's the same theme. Maven is a good example, checking out a group of related maven projects into a workspace lets you develop and see errors in real time. If not a workspace what else would you suggest? An RCP application can be a different beast depending on what its used for but in the true IDE sense I don't know what would be a better solution than a workspace or context of projects. Just my thoughts. - Duncan
Basically the scope of workspace(s) is divided in two points.
First point (and primary) is the eclipse it self and is related with the settings and metadata configurations (plugin ctr). Each time you create a project, eclipse collects all the configurations and stores them on that workspace and if somehow in the same workspace a conflicting project is present you might loose some functionality or even stability of eclipse it self.
And second (secondary) the point of development strategy one can adopt.
Once the primary scope is met (and mastered) and there's need for further adjustments regarding project relations (as libraries, perspectives ctr) then initiate separate workspace(s) could be appropriate based on development habits or possible language/frameworks "behaviors".
DLTK for examples is a beast that should be contained in a separate cage.
Lots of complains at forums for it stopped working (properly or not at all) and suggested solution was to clean the settings of the equivalent plugin from the current workspace.
Personally, I found myself lean more to language distinction when it comes to separate workspaces which is relevant to known issues that comes with the current state of the plugins are used. Preferably I keep them in the minimum numbers as this is leads to less frustration when the projects are become... plenty and version control is not the only version you keep your projects.
Finally, loading speed and performance is an issue that might come up if lots of (unnecessary) plugins are loaded due to presents of irrelevant projects.
Bottom line; there is no one solution to every one, no master blue print that solves the issue. It's something that grows with experience,
Less is more though!
Although I've used Eclipse for years, this "answer" is only conjecture (which I'm going to try tonight). If it gets down-voted out of existence, then obviously I'm wrong.
Oracle relies on CMake to generate a Visual Studio "Solution" for their MySQL Connector C source code. Within the Solution are "Projects" that can be compiled individually or collectively (by the Solution). Each Project has its own makefile, compiling its portion of the Solution with settings that are different than the other Projects.
Similarly, I'm hoping an Eclipse Workspace can hold my related makefile Projects (Eclipse), with a master Project whose dependencies compile the various unique-makefile Projects as pre-requesites to building its "Solution". (My folder structure would be as #Rafael describes).
So I'm hoping a good way to use Workspaces is to emulate Visual Studio's ability to combine dissimilar Projects into a Solution.
It's just a feature for structuring projects.
Obviously Eclipse designers tried to avoid having global settings for Eclipse and decided to put them into workspace.
Each Eclipse app depends on each workspace settings.
Is it a good decision? I think it's not so.
It lacks flexibility. It was naive to expect that global settings can be avoided.
It doesn't allow you to have single projects (it can be a surprise for Eclipse designers but it happens quite often).
But it still works.
Many people use it. Sometimes they suffer but more frequently everything is ok.
I am newbie to Eclipse, I am planning to use it for AVR development with WinAVR and gcc.
The feature I am looking for is the grouping of different files in the project, like all headers together, all source files together and all files excluded from the build together etc.
I tried AVR Studio from Atmel, it has this grouping feature but it lacks several other features which Eclipse supports. Any help to configure Eclipse Project explorer to display the project files in this way would be appreciated and helpful for me to decide the IDE to use.
Note: I know that I can manually add different folders for each of these groups and move the files, but that moves the physical files, and breaks the relative path in the code, and other comilers/IDE's. I am looking for logical grouping of files.
Unfortunately there is no general way for a user to configure the grouping in the Project Explorer, the grouping is setup based on the code that controls the content (i.e. CDT, JDT, etc). I think it would be interesting to have this feature, but it's not clear the UI that can be used to specify it. You are welcome to submit an enhancement request to add this to the Eclipse Platform UI project. And giving an example of how it's done in another product would be helpful.
Thanks Francis, looking at your profile I think I found the right person to solve my issue :)
I have opened it as a bug (as I could not find a feature request in bugzila) Bug 296514 - Logical Grouping Files in Project Explorer in Eclipse
I have attcahed screenshots of both AVR Studio and Eclipse project explorer. That should give you an idea of what kind of UI features I am requesting. I can difinetely provide more information if you want.
I think what you are looking for can be done with Working Sets.
I was always wondering why it is a big deal having version control support inside an IDE.
I always preferred to use a command-line/standalone version of the version control of choice and never found IDE integration helpful.
I know it can be helpful sometimes, for example to automatically keep track of renames, but I was bitten by version control plugins a couple of times (especially the ClearCase Eclipse plugin) that I'm now finding it counter productive compared to the command-line version, where I have better control.
What is your opinion?
Integrated Source Control also helps to only keep the important files under Source control. For example, when I add a new File in Visual Studio, the Plugin (visualSVN) will allow me to add it easily without me having to remember to go outside of my IDE and run the command to add it to the repository. On the other hand, it will automatically ignore temporary files, like the obj/ and bin/ Folders.
Essentially: Integrated Version Control that actually works is a great way to keep the repository clean and complete.
I like how some IDE's implement this. Ankh-SVN for Visual Studio is not that great and is a bit buggy, however Subeclipse I find to work exceedingly well when I'm using Eclipse.
I think it really depends on the IDE you're using and the quality of that plug-in. It's going to work well for some setups and terrible for others.
That's why I like Subversion with Tortoise SVN so much. I can choose to use the IDE integration when and where it makes sense, otherwise, just like you said, I can simply use the command line or in my case, the windows explorer based client!
Integration of the IDE with version control and, in particular, software change management (SCM) helps bringing together the philosophies of the IDE and the source control system.
One example is temporary files and binaries, that should not be checked-in and, e.g. in Visual Studio, end up within the source directory if you're not carefully creating new project and solution templates with a non-default directory configuration.
Another could be tracking of work items and complex bug fixes.
Also it saves some ceremony and context-switching when editing files.
Advanced integrations may also allow to push the change management system's concept of "configuration" ("branch", "tag", "view") into the IDE.
ClearCase integration, however, is clearly not "advanced".
A lot of it is simply the preference and comfort level of the user. Some folks are comfortable with the command line. Some prefer a GUI.
I wouldn't make generalized assumptions that all version control within the IDE is bad or buggy based on experiences with a particular plugin which had issues.
Why even have an IDE? Why not just do everything with a command line? ;)
The answer is that having it integrated with the IDE is "better".
My #1 reason:
You can visually see if a file is checked out or not, and if you need to edit a file, you can take the action right there where you are working.
There are more, but that is the big one.
It's depend on your IDE and the way you work with VCS.
Me and my team using VSS plugin-ins inside Delphi IDE, it gives a lot of flexibable feature when working together for example, All our forms are check-in when you start to write a letter or move components it asked if you want to check-out the code file or form.
also when some one change any code in other forms, it pop up and telling you it's already update by someone else and asking you to update current files in your H.D.
and you just get everything while you are in the IDE, you don't need to move to other external file, or command prompt to do a simple task.
I find most people who like to deal with command prompt working mostly in code without GUI IDE or may I be wrong.
Nearly all of my subversion needs can be handled by the IDE interface. It's a lot faster to do 2 quick clicks than pop up a command line, cd to the right place, issue the command, etc.
Command line has it's place, but with the current crop of IDEs, that place continues to shrink.
I have battle scars from using a buggy implementation of an IDE/VCS integration. In all honesty, if it was not buggy it would have been great. As long as there are great tools like TortoiseSVN, I don't see a need for IDE/VCS integration. I'd rather have more tools that do their job well than a few buggy tools.
Version control support in an IDE generally gives you a better view. The IDE actually knows what type of file you are looking at when doing a diff, which means it can do context highlighting and help you do merges more effectively.
I also think it saves setup time. In stead of installing all kinds of tools, a developer can download the IDE, do a checkout an be on it's way. If every developer on a project uses the same IDE, they can help eachother.
"Counterproductive" is a large word. If you have serious CVS/SVN problems maybe once a month, it's still way to few to have complicated clients installed on all your dev machines.
I have both systems where there is an integrated IDE (Microsoft FrontPage against an IIS Development Web site with Visual Source Safe on all of the web content) and where there is not (java command-line development, Visual Studio Express Editions). An intermediate case that I use is jEdit 4.x with VSS integration via plug-in.
I think the integrated case is valuable for the reason it always is -- you don't have to leave your application to interact with source-control functions and you don't have to worry about remembering to add new files and to check out files before editing them. The ability to have a smooth work process and to minimize the risk of oversights is powerful, as far as I am concerned. Even when the IDE-plugin integration is less than perfect (the jEdit 4.x case), I still prefer it over not having it.
I also agree that having explorer integration on Windows, the case for Tortoise SVN, is also a great capability, even when IDE integration is available. This allows convenient operation without having to launch the IDE while also being able to launch from the explorer window into the IDE (depending on file type) or editor or make or whatever while operating in Windows Explorer.
And yes, the command-line interfaces remain valuable, especially for scripting of recuring-operation patterns.
I operate in many contexts. Having low barriers and fluidity of operation in all of them is to be prized.
I'm not sure I understand the question. IDEs by definition are integrated, meaning that they're supposed to help you avoid the need to get out of the environment for anything project-related. Version control obviously fits the bill.
If you're looking for more practical reasons, one is that IDEs can offer you awareness by the nature of their graphical presentation. Eclipse, for example, will present files and directories that have changed. With additional plugins or suites, you can ever get real-time awareness as soon as another user is editing the same file, helping you predict a merge conflict before it occurs. I'm not familiar with a commandline based mechanism.
I use intellij integrated with cvs on a regular basis and by far the best feature of the integration of version control inside the IDE is line-by-line indications of what is added, edited, or deleted along with easy access (mouse hover/tool tip) to the pre-edit changes.
This is all within the source code in a non-obtrusive way.
For the nuts and bolts of version control (checkin/checkout/update/etc) I sometimes use the IDE and sometimes use the command line.
The number 1 reason for an SCM integrated with the IDE is that it makes it more effortless to use it and eliminates the need to REMEMBER to check things out. Through experience I have seen that steps that developers construe as extraneous, which often encompases anything other than writing code, don't get done. Making them do extra steps increases the odds that developers won't bother with it and will work around the source control system
I use eclipse for quite a lot of work, including:
multiple "utility" projects that include code that most of my java work makes use of
various plugin-related projects that I sync and use periodically (eg: the Git plugin)
plugin projects I'm actually developing
the occasional pydev / non-java project
etc...
It is becoming quite difficult to keep all these things straight, particularly since I never need to use them all at once. I've tried using Mylyn (and I'm trying it again) but in the past it has caused eclipse to run extremely slow, and I am notoriously horrible at remembering to tell mylyn that I've switched tasks, so it tends to learn very odd (and largely useless) sets of resources.
I've considered using multiple workspaces, but that is problematic when multiple projects need to exist in multiple workspaces, and when I need to synchronize the eclipse metadata directories across workspaces.
What is the best way to manage complex working environments in eclipse? Other development environments aren't a viable option because there aren't any sane alternatives when it comes to developing eclipse plugins (and that is a requirement).
(I think a very similar question was asked a month or two ago, but I haven't been able to find it...)
It isn't quite clear to me what your need is. But have you tried using working sets in the Package Explorer?
Open the Package Explorer view, open its menu, and Select Working Set. That lets you give a name to a subset of all the projects loaded in your workspace.
Switch working sets using the package Explorer menu. Use working sets to limit the scope of Search, errors, problems, etc.
Define as many working sets as you need to group your projects. A project can be part of any number of working sets.
Here's a screencast about working sets -- this does look like the right answer.
http://www.peterfriese.de/eclipse-working-sets-part-i/
You want to use "Working Sets".
I would recommend using different workspaces, and then adding the common projects to each workspace (you can specify the location of the project to be outside of the workspace). I believe this will work, but I haven't tried it, so I can't be sure.
As #JesperE and #Dennis S suggested, working sets will help you organize your projects, but they may not make eclipse run any faster, since the projects will all still be loaded into the workspace.