I would like to try some iPhone development but am not a Mac user. I'm not keen to spend a load of cash on a new mac, so if I were to buy an old Mac on ebay, what system should I look at as a minimum for an acceptable iphone dev machine. Cheaper the better obviously.
Note: Not keen on running mac os on a pc so really looking for an apple hardware option. Is an old mac mini suitable?
Any Mac with an Intel processor will do fine.
You can spend your time searching eBay for an old Intel Mac but in my experience it a false economy (especially if it's more than 3 year old).
One tip for anyone looking for a
secondhand Mac, as I did in the late
90s during the last economic downturn,
buy computers from graphic design
agencies or software houses that have
gone bust.
Good
Mac Mini - It'll do every thing you need (albeit not very fast). You might consider extra memory and if you have a a spare keyboard and monitor (or KVM switch) your away.
Better
New MacBook - released yesterday (2009-06-08) the new MacBooks are reasonably priced and a great option especially if you want (or are replacing) a laptop. Again RAM is a consideration and if you plan on long coding sessions a decent keyboard and monitor are essential.
Best
Dive right in and get a iMac (20" or 24")! I suggest you only do this if you want to replace an older non-Apple box. The calculation you have to make is: How much would I spend on a new PC plus how much would I spend on my development Mac. If the total is even close the price of an iMac it's an option.
You'll have the option of virtualized Windows, (unlimited) Linux installs, Boot Camp if your a Gamer and Mac OS X for your iPhone/Cocoa development.
If money is no problem you can even go for a Mac Pro.
My system is a Mac Pro - I run Windows XP, Vista and 2 x Cent OS's (simultaneously). Also I have Windows 7 Beta and a few Ubuntu's for ad hoc work.
It works great - but wont be for everyone taste. I replaced my Uni set up of: 1 x Mac, 1 x PowerBook, 1 x Wintel box and only using Linux on campus with MacPro and iPhone (I still have the PowerBook, but it's hardly ever used).
Also, if wanting to buy a 'new' mac, you can buy refurbished macs from Applestore which are hundreds less than their newer equivalents. They have full warranty and are pretty much brand new anyway. (Returned for some issue that has since been fixed)
Of course, if you're happy to jailbreak your iphone, you can ssh into it and compile apps directly on the device (the jailbreak can install gcc and make and the rest). I've done this for a couple of experimental projects while trying to learn objective C and all that stuff. Worth trying out if you're not totally sure whether or not you want to go ahead with it.
I use a mac mini, works ok so far.
In addition you need a monitor with dvi, a usb mouse and usb keyboard.
The main drawback is, that i use a regular usb keyboard and the keyboard layout is terrible, e.g. POS1, END, PAGE_UP, PAGE_DOWN are not where they should be.
You can use PearPC, i used it for the same reason as you.
Check it here: PearPC Mac OS X on PC
But i just wanted to experiment something with the iphone SDK, if you want to develop seriously you should consider getting a MAC because a virtual machine is terribly slow.
If you really want a cheap option you could go for a Dell Mini 9. It runs OS X very well and if you upgrade to 2M ram you could probably make it work for you. I picked it up for a bit over $200, have been reasonably happy with it.
Related
What is the minimum configuration to do some Python and iPhone development on Mac ?
Platform wise: Mac Mini, Mac Pro, Mac Book, Mac Book Pro ?
Memory requirement
CPU speed
Thanks for your advice.
Laurent
The minimum requirement is an intel mac. Any intel mac will work. iPhone development is unsupported on PPC.
Python can be done on any mac that runs os x.
The minimum requirement, and what's pleasant are different things. Everything you've listed will work pretty great. You might want to bump up the ram a little on what they ship with, but other than that you're good to go.
Any of those platforms are going to be more than adequate for iPhone development, but since Apple is not allowing anything that requires a VM or an interpreted environment, there is no way to do iPhone development using Python at this time.
EDIT: Looks like I misread that as doing Python development on an iPhone, so just ignore the second part of my answer. Any of those platforms are going to be fine for either iPhone or Python development.
Rather ephemeral in our requirements, aren't we. 'Some' python/iPhone....
You will be well served by a mini, starting # $600, they're a steal. Upgrade the processor (2.53ghz), add RAM to 4GB (after purchase, if you're comfortable) throw a generic keyboard, mouse and Monitor on it and you've got a heck of a machine.
Don't bother with a HD upgrade, just get an external USB disk and put all your VM's and extra necessities on it.
Any system that Apple sells is sufficient to do Python and iPhone development on the Mac. I generally consider 2 GB to be the minimum amount of RAM that I would want to use, and 4 GB if I'm going to be doing any significant amount of work in a VM (for instance, VMware Fusion or Parallels for running Windows within Mac OS X). But I think all configurations currently come with at least 2 GB of RAM, so you should be set there, too.
Of course faster machines are always better, so you should get a machine that's fast enough for you, but I have a couple year old Mac Book Pro and find that's fast enough for me.
The biggest help for development is multiple monitors. Having two monitors helps a lot (and three is good, too). I believe that all of Apple's current systems support two monitors.
After trying and failing to get my hands on a temporary Mac to develop an iPhone app for a client, I've started to look into VMware Workstation to virtualize OS X. I was wondering if there are any gotchas that people have found, or if the whole thing is unworkable.
For the record, I have an old stripey-Apple logo I pried off my old Apple IIe and am affixing to the lid of my dev laptop so that I'm complying with the spirit of the OS X EULA.
Some of my coworkers have tried the VMWare approach with OSX and have, for the most part, failed. I know there are some VMWare images floating around on the internets, but I wouldn't recommend using any of those.
Also to Bruce's point, the OSX86 project has made some great progress lately. I was able to get OSX running on an old Dell I have laying around. The thing ran fine as a media server until I made the mistake of downloading a patch, and then the thing died.
As Bruce stated a Mac Mini would be a good investment at $500, or better yet, check out eBay. Pick up something on eBay and at the end of your job you can sell it back on eBay or keep it. If your really tight on your budget you can look for a G4 Mac and do development on that, sans support for the iPhone simulator. I picked up a 2 G4 Macs for $80 a piece and sold one for $120.
Bottom line is if your thinking of getting into iPhone development make a small investment on a Mini or a used Intel Mac on eBay. If your successful in you development efforts your investment will pay off.
Good luck.
Edit: Though development on a G4/PPC mac is not supported it is doable. Here is a link outlining how to get it working.
http://3by9.com/85/
Prepare for an onslaught of replies on the EULA.
Technically your best resource would be the OSx86 website which is here http://wiki.osx86project.org/.
And their page on virtualisation is here
http://wiki.osx86project.org/wiki/index.php/Virtualization
Importantly though, developing for the Mac and iPhone are very similar, and if you are serious about doing good developmenet for your clients you should probably invest in a mac mini at the least, which is less than $500US more than just buying the OS by itself.
That's the old rainbow logo from the IIe, right? Die-hards have the white Apple sticker that comes with every real Mac. Real die-hards have the white Apple sticker they surreptitiously peeled off their nephew's toy truck.
Cheapest option is probably to partition your hard-drive and install hackintosh:
http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/05/eight-months-with-a-hackintosh-netbook-conclusion-fantastic/
But if every time you build your app in XCode it takes long enough to catch a sitcom on TV, don't come crying here :-)
I have a friend who's successfully installed 10.5.7 on a his Dell laptop using a distro of OSx86. He's got the developer tools and the iPhone simulator working, and he can compile his app. He can't find a USB driver for his hardware, though - so he hasn't been able to install his app on a device.
Honestly though - I think he's spent about 20 hours getting things setup, finding drivers, etc... We all thought he was crazy until he actually got the dev tools installed. I'd really try hard to get my hands on a Mac Mini before going through all the hassle.
But the Apple logo transplant... pure genius.
Obvious legalities aside, in my experience OS X performs very poorly in a VM. Installing OS X natively on your PC is possible if you have patience, and happen to have compatible hardware. I can't honestly recommend this approach however, unless you're a glutton for punishment, or would like to hearken back to those golden days when installing Linux with support for all your hardware was actually a small triumph in itself.
As others have mentioned, if you are serious about iPhone development, you're going to save yourself a lot of hassle by getting yourself a secondhand or refurbished Mac mini.
I want to try some "programming for iphone".
For that I need a Mac OS X, no question about it.. But I have a problem I don't have a Mac Computer.
I have a Intel Dual-Core PC, running XP. Snow Leopard its for Intel, but for Intel Mac computers, right?.
If I manage to install Mac OS X Snow Leopard in my Notebook.
Do you think I can still install and do programming for Iphone, as well in a Mac Computer?
There will be any problems in the programming or debugging?
And there is another thing.. I don't have an iphone. That will may be a problem right?
Yes, as long as you got it installed correctly and it worked well with your hardware (drivers working correctly and hardware properly identified). http://osx86.thefreesuite.com/ If you are doing iPhone development, you need to pay special attention to making sure your USB drivers are working well to. This and other driver/hardware issues may give a headache trying to get things to not only work, but work well and properly.
That is not the easiest task though and can be a real pain in the anatomy. A used cheap intel mac is the way to go to get started. (mini, imac). Just make sure it is an intel mac.
If you dont have an iphone, then you would just use the simulator for all your testing. This is not ideal though as you could not test your app properly. You also cannot use all iphone features in the simulator. It can only simulate so much.
For more info on limitations of simulator. http://trailsinthesand.com/iphone-sdk-simulator-limitations/
Here is a discussion on why the mini is a good choice: Will a Mac Mini suffice for an iPhone Development machine?
Discussion on developing with Ipod Touch vs. Iphone for the Iphone: iPod Touch compared to iPhone as development platform for iPhone apps
And a question over at serverfault about os x install on pc: https://serverfault.com/questions/38496/mac-os-x-install-on-pc-hard-drive/38498#38498
This isn't the place, but providing you get OSX running then:
You need stable USB support for your MB
You might need to mix-up OSX and Darwin/Mach to get full hardware support
The iPhone emulator may well include hardware-checking code
It is cheaper to buy a second hand mac-mini
The questions already been answered but I want to add this to the overall topic.
I specifically bought a Mac to develop iPhone applications. What this single task opened up is far beyond what I was expecting. To list a few things:
I'm extremely impressed with the hardware. No hardware vendor competes with Mac's hardware from what I can tell.
The OS is sweet. I can't list all of the details but the virtual desktops alone is wonderful. Check out the Wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X
I run Windows Vista from VirtualBox and it works great.
Objective-C -- A very nice programming language; I which I could use it more on windows.
All in all, I can literally get rid of all of my non-apple hardware and run Mac OS X and Vista from the Mac hardware and everything would be great.
My point is, the Mac is worth the price.
Buying a $999 Mac may not be such a bad idea...
And please note, running the Mac OS on a non apple computer is technically a license violation. I don't agree it should be, but it technically is.
UPDATE: You said that you want to see how it is done. You don't need a Mac (or the OS) assuming that you don't want to compile and run programs. Visit the iPhone Developer page at apple. You can get some free samples just by doing the basic free registration (don't sign up for the paid one).
From there, you should be able to download a few samples and look though the source code. You won't be able to view Interface Builder files, but this would at least give you some idea of the Objective-C code.
You can further gather more information online by going to websites like:
iPhone Development Blog
iPhone Development
iPhone Development Bits
There's a commercial environment which allows to develop iPhone applications directly from a Windows machine. You might want to give it a look instead of going through the huge and illegal hassle of setting up a hacked version of OS X on your PC.
http://www.dragonfiresdk.com/index.htm
It was released recently and they claim that some applications produced with it have already been approved for release in the App Store.
From http://daringfireball.net/linked/2010/06/15/dragonfire-sdk :
Their pitch: write iPhone apps using C and C++ on Windows, using Visual Studio, using Zimusoft’s SDK and their own iPhone Simulator. Then you upload your project to Zimusoft’s servers, where they take the project and compile it using an actual Mac and Xcode. You can then submit the resulting “real” binary to the App Store yourself, or let Zimusoft publish it to the App Store themselves.
Try Hackint0sh VM-ware torrents, I haven't had any luck so I bought a iMac instead but I hear that this is an option.
For first testings and learning the language and the concepts this should work. Maybe you are even able to install mac os into a vmware or virtualbox virtualmachine don't know which program applies for your operating system. You should be able to run Xcode and the Simulator and learn all the basics.
But if you want to develop serious Iphone apps I think you need an Iphone because getting a feeling for performance, User Interaction with the touch screen and so on can only be tested on the device itself.
And by the way I think this the perfectly right place for this question.
Agreed with most of the above points.
Mac mini's have gotten cheaper as of late especially if you buy a used one. Think of it this way if you buy a mac mini your first goal as an app developer is to release a paid app that will pay for your mac mini. Making money on the app store is NOT rocket science. It just takes a decent product and some common sense.
Another solution instead of getting an iPhone is to get an iPod touch. It will gives you 80% of the iPhone functionality for development testing and you won't have to sign up for the monthly plan.
FYI if you want to build for Blackberry up until recently it was hard to do without Windows so its not as if Apple is the only one that forces you into certain hardware/software combos to build for their platform. If you want to build for Windows you need to run Windows.
I'm buying a mac in a month or so but could like to start working on an Iphone app before I actually get my mac. Is this possible on xp or ubuntu? I know that I won't be able to compile it or test it for the iPhone to I get my mac but maybe I can get alot of my upfront work out of the way.
If you're brave you can turn your PC into a hackintosh and dual-boot into Leopard. I did this for several months for iPhone development before getting a Mac.
Yes, you can use VMWare to run MacOS X. I'm not going to link to any sites but there are a number of downloads available for a hacked OSX image for VMWare.
You can do a Hackintosh but beware:
Apple can and does force iPhone devs to update to the latest OS to handle the latest iPhone SDK. Your hackintosh will lag official OS updates by several weeks or months, until Kalyway team (or whomever) gets it working and stable. So effectively you are locked into older firmware development when this happens.
Hackintoshes are notorious for suddenly not working, and not BOOTING at all because of some internal tweak you made when you installed something. Not yours of course, you are awesome and would of course keep a complete backup of your entire OS partition at all times to handle this. It's a PITA.
It takes some doing to install Mac OS X on commodity hardware. It's a pain in the ass and took me like 20 installs of the OS to get right. You of course are awesome and would do it much more quickly and with less headaches.
Hackintoshes (and PCs in general) are LOUD. Gamer-spec fans and so forth are loud, compared to my Mac Pro, which sits here silent as the grave. It's not that big a deal but it really got on my nerves how loud my machine was.
In short, you can do it, but it's hardly worth the effort. You do get a charge when you've got it booting into OS X the first time though, which is kind of neat. But for serious production use? Get a Mac Mini for 500 bucks and get to work. If you're like me your time is more valuable than the small amount you will pay for a real Mac.
Don't think so. Maybe you could build a hackintosh.
I've heard from someone at our cocoaheads that they managed to find a VMWare image for OS X
I’m thinking about trying some development for the iPhone, is it possible to install Leopard inside VMWare? I already have a pretty high spec PC with a comfy setup that I’d like to use, or do I need to buy a real Mac?
It is legal to run Mac OS X Server in a virtual machine on Apple hardware. All other forms of Mac OS X virtualization are currently forbidden.
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We have tried many virtual cloud mac providers including:
Mac in Cloud
virtualmacosx.com
xcodeclub
By far the best support we got was from xcodeclub. Daniel (the owner) personally provisioned a trial virtual machine and allowed us to see if our programs ran before purchasing the service. Java 7 ended up not working on virtual Mac due to some graphics drivers issues but Daniel spent over an hour of his personal time helping us. Now that is how customer service should be like. We highly recommend his service.
You can rent a virtual Mac with a service like www.MacinCloud.com.
Legally, you need to buy a Mac. It is "possible" to run (at least Tiger) in VMWare -- the experience is not optimal, but you can do it. It's also possible to run OS X on PC hardware; however, it's an exercise in illegal software and hacks.
I've run OSX under VMWare, and I can tell you with confidence that it is not an environment that you would find comfortable for developing applications in. It was barely (not really) usable for testing Mac specific browser bugs that couldn't be reproduced in Safari on Windows.
On the other hand, if your hardware is supported by OSx86, you can run it natively at reasonable speeds, and I would expect it to make a fairly nice dev environment.
For all cases, I'm going to assume that you have a legal OS X license, and don't mind the legal ambiguity of running it on hardware which the license explicitly forbids (the legality is unclear, imo, but I really think you'd be ok as long as its not a pirated copy).
Unfortunately, there's no legal way to run OS X in a virtual machine.
For developing iPhone apps you probably don't need a particularly beefy machine, so maybe look into grabbing a mac mini? They're the cheapest Macs you can get, and should probably be just fine for doing iPhone work. Plus, now you have a mac that you can use for testing other things too! :)