I am implementing an iPhone/iPad app that allows users to send each other messages using the bonjour protocol. Basically, a server publishes his service over bonjour and the clients connected to the same wifi can discover his service and connect to it to start sending messages. The problem I've found is that some routers seem to have problems with Bonjour. When running my app at home or at some other places it works perfectly. The publishing and discovering of the bonjour services works flawlessly. However when I tried my app at one of my friend's apartments, some (not all) of the clients were not able to discover the published bonjour service. I also noticed that other apps that use Bonjour (such as Apple's Remote app) were also having trouble on said network. After doing some digging I've found that other people have had similar problems with bonjour and some routers. Therefore I have 2 questions:
1) Does anyone know if this problem with Bonjour that some routers seem to have is a widespread issue? In other words, if my app relies on Bonjour in order to function at all, do I have to be worried that it won't work in 50% of the WLAN networks or do most routers not have any issues with bonjour. Obviously I can't expect anyone to know how every router out there deals with bonjour packets but maybe there are some Networking gurus that can point me in the right direction :-p.
2) Second, if bonjour is too risky of a protocol to build my app on, what are some alternatives with similar features? The features I would (preferably) need would be service publishing and discovery without users having to manually enter IP addresses of other phones.
Ok thanks for your help! I understand that this is kind of a broad question but any help is appreciated! :)
This is potentially a tough nut to crack. The problem causing devices not to find each other on certain networks is related to the underlying transport (i.e. multicast UDP) and not Bonjour (or mDNS or whatever else you wanna call it).
In high-level, non-rigorous terms, multicast data puts more load on routers. Large corporate and university networks sometimes like to drop Bonjour messages (i.e. UDP packets sent to the multicast group 224.0.0.251 on port 5353) because it means the network isn't inundated with thousands of clients advertising their iTunes libraries or whatever, and at scale this can improve general performance. At the other end of the spectrum, some domestic routers drop multicast packets out of the box for reasons known only to the manufacturer. There's not a whole lot you can do about either situation.
Try running a tcpdump on the network to see if the packets are actually coming through. I've not come across a home router that doesn't forward them for a while. If they're not, you'll have to come up with some central [internet-facing, perhaps?] lookup facility. If they're visible, then there's something up with your implementation.
There's nothing stopping you from writing your own simpler protocol for service discovery to be sent over multicast- it's just that there are loads of Bonjour clients in a ton of different languages already written and tested.
Related
I think I have a fundamental misunderstanding of how networking and peer-to-peer applications work, I would be really appreciative if someone could help clear things up for me.
I am designing a small peer-to-peer file sharing application, and it seems like I can't connect to a device on another network without forwarding a port from the router to that device. This seems rather tedious; if everyone using the application has to forward a port to their device it would make the application unpractical. Is there some way that p2p apps communicate with each other directly, or are p2p applications actually just a set of server and client applications working together to form a network?
In other words, do I need to forward a port on one machine and use it as a server initially, then as the network grows larger just hope that others will do the same? Or is there something I don't know / don't understand about how p2p communication works?
I have an idea of an application that involves a "chat feature", basically an ability for people to chat with each other. Since sending messages through a server would be slow (plus it would be pretty bad having to check the server every second if you have new messages) I want to use sockets to have peer to peer chat ability instead of going through a server.
My 2 questions:
1) Is socket programming the most optimal way to develop a chat program? I know there is push notification service, but I don't think it can be used for a chat program too well. Going through a server seems kind of bad if you imagine 5,000 people chatting and having to poll the server every second.
2) Will Apple have issues approving an app that has peer to peer chat program that uses sockets?
Thank you.
Sockets are indeed appropriate. But you are better off with a client/server approach rather than a P2P approach.
Having worked on a very well known instant messaging service for many years, I can tell you absolutely that going through a server is not slow - as long as your server is not slow.
Client/server has lots of advantages. Namely, it's not as difficult as any sort of P2P connectivity where such issues as NATs and Firewalls make direct socket connections difficult and unreliable. Besides, you would need a messaging service anyway for clients to exchange IP addresses.
Your stated assumption that a client or server would have to "poll" is not how scalable systems work. You should use a persistent TCP socket and look at scaling a socket service up though any of the available async methods that exist today. select(), poll(), epoll on Linux, and IO Completion Ports on Windows are all techniques for having thousands of sockets simultaneously connected without periodic polling.
My suggestion - just deploy an XMPP/Jabber server. Most implementations scale up nicely to the thousands of clients. Then your chat program is just an XMPP client socket. Some of the Jabber servers even support HTTP connectivity for situations where a user's only access is via an http or http proxy server. I played around with Openfire a while back and was reasonably impresseed.
I'm fairly certain that iOS has sockets, and that it's allowed by Apple. I only know via second hand from folks that have worked on iOS products. You probably shouldn't use the push notification service for anything more than notifications to wake up your app that there is something it needs to do.
Hope this helps.
I want to connect multiple devices through socket without any server implementation.I will use that only for getting the IP addresses of the devices that will register.
There are two major problems to peer-to-peer communications: discovery, and reachability.
First, you need to know the IP address of the other peers to connect to them. Once you're connected to a mesh of peers, they can all keep each other updated on the state of the network, suggesting better peers to each other, passing around notifications of new peers who've joined and left, etc. But you have to design and implement a mechanism for trading that information. More importantly, you need to jumpstart things in some way, because when a new peer starts up, it's in a mesh of just itself, and it has no information to give itself.
One possibility is to have a handful of well-known "superpeers" (that you run) that are always connected, and bake their addresses into the app. Or you can have "introduction servers" instead of peers, serving much the same function. Or you can have some external way of trading addresses (the simplest is that users trade them on a web forum or an IRC channel or in person and type them in manually), which can be automated to various degrees. There are also shortcuts that can help—Bonjour can get other peers onto the mesh as long as one peer on the LAN is already there; GameCenter/GameKit can be used as an automated external trading network; etc.
Once you've solved the discovery problem, you still have the reachability problem. Most iOS devices usually don't have publicly-accessible IP addresses; instead, they're behind routers that do Network Address Translation, whether they be a home WiFi router or a cell carrier's 3G network. This means you need some way to do NAT Hole Punching to get two iPhones talking to each other. Somebody who knows both the public address and the internal address of each device can arrange for them to set up a connection to each other. You can have either normal peers do this (although that makes the jumpstart problem even bigger) or have your superpeers/introduction servers/etc. do it.
If you want to build all of this yourself, you probably want to look at other implementations. BitTorrent (including trackers and DHT) is well-understood and documented at a continuum of levels ranging from "lies-to-children" for curious end users to detailed protocol specs and open source implementations. And then look at some other P2P networks, because BitTorrent is not perfect, and doesn't try to do everything that everyone's come up with.
You can use GameKit. It has the matchmaking api that can help you.
It can be used for non game apps.
I've been working on something similar and it's a giant pain in the ass. There are 3 considerations: 1) Reachability 2) Discovery 3) The connection itself.
1) Don't even consider using 3g/4g, it just won't work well for keeping an open socket connection.
2) I'd use some sort of broker service between the two on the internet to connect the two. For discovery, you can just list what devices are available on the service.
3) For the connection, I find the IOS socket libraries to be rather painful to use, but if you go down to the BSD socket level it's not as bad. I think it'd be very interesting to use zmq sockets; that might simplify writing the broker service.
You can't. If the device is all online with wifi, it maybe possible and rely on the router setting just like pc connect. If some device is connected with 3g or gprs protocal , they may have no ip address at all.
I have try to make chat application with socket programing and I am using Chatty source code and its working perfect on same network. But not work for different network.
Is chatty work for different network iPhone?
I have tried chatty for different network in iPhone but no success.
Any idea about chatty for different network for iPhone?
From looking at the source code for Chatty, it seems that it just uses an IP and port number to connect to a different device, and that's the reason why you can't connect when users are in a different network. Being able to connect or not will depend a lot on the network configuration you both of your devices have.
For example: it works if you're in the same wifi, because there's no firewall between the devices, and the IP is reachable (192.168.x.x, for example). If you take one of the phones to a 3G network, it won't be able to reach the other one in the wifi, but the one in the wifi might still be able to reach the one on the 3G, depending on your career and port number, and if the network stack is on in the phone. So, conclusion is: this will be highly unreliable.
Usually, for this kind of communication, apps rely on a third party, so both of your phones connect first to a webserver, that is always available on the internet, and the web server sends the messages to each of the apps. This also solves the problem of one app going off the network (when you take an elevator, for example).
Is it possible to connect a socket between two mobile devices (iPhones) over the internet?
I am trying to discover the IP of each device and connect directly. I know it can be done with Bonjour but that only works on local networks. I need a high speed connection between two devices over the internet.
Thanks.
If you had both the IP's and they were both routable, it should be possible. I'm not sure though if the IP's given out by the 3G network are routable. If you are using WIFI, the IP you get is almost certainly not routable. Assuming you have a routable IP though, it should be possible.
The trick is just discovering the IP of the other device. The best way to do that would probably be to have each device register its IP with a web service when your app starts up, then query that service to find the IPs of other devices.
It might get a bit tricky managing "unregistering" IPs when the app is closed or when an IP changes though, but it should be doable.
ETA:
If you have a server that they can both connect to, you should be able to implement a solution using that server (i.e. without the phones actually directly connecting to each other). This would avoid the issue of having routable IPs for the phones.
As for how to bridge the sockets together - your server program would basicly work like an old-school phone switchboard operator. You'd have some kind of registration & discovery protocol built into the server software that would allow a phone to register itself with the server, query a list of the other phones currently connected to the server, indicate which phone it wants to talk to, and accept connections from other phones.
Once it knows who wants to talk to whom, your server software would connect the two together by reading from one phone's socket and writing that data to the other phone's socket.
Only a suggestion, but if you can get each of them to connect to a third site, you'll then know the address of each. Send the address of phone A to phone B (and/or phone B to phone A) and then have them connect as you see fit.
Have you looked through all the 3.0 features? Specifically peer networking (the existence of which is public).
WiFi routers often have a feature called "Port Triggering" which allows internal hosts (in this case an iPhone) to inform the router that they would like to have a connections on particular port forwarded to them. I have no idea if the iPhone supports this protocol.
For IP lookup you may consider using DynamicDNS if the two hosts are known ahead of time OR as stated above a custom web service if they are not (i.e. friends exchanging hostnames vs. strangers discovering each other)
This is an old thread, but I just came across it. You could use a STUN server (or NAT-PMP) to get the public IP address/port combo and then SMS it over to the other phone. So long as you open a listening port on the first device, then your second device can just connect directly using the publi IP address/port you sent to it in the SMS (SMS push registry can automatically wake up your app on the second device to do this)
I have run into this issue with an app I was developing. I was trying to connect to a PC cell card from an iPhone. The problem is that AT&T doesn't enable mobile termination for iPhones so it is physically impossible for two phones on an AT&T network to connect to one another. This is straight from an AT&T antenna engineer.
I was able to get this to work by having the iPhone VPN into a server and then connect to the PC cell card but other than that, it wouldn't work.
I have a very strong feeling (but no evidence) that the iPhone address is going to be non-routable. Of course it actually depends on the operator but AT&T give out 10.x.x.x addresses.
Apple have sample (desktop) code that uses Bonjour to implement portmapping on a WiFi router that supports UnPnP.